Warning to Artists: Instagram Goes Down, What This Means (MED Podcast Episode 3)

Warning to Artists: Instagram Goes Down, What This Means (MED Podcast Episode 3)



one reason why it was a great thing that Instagram went down yesterday was that that many people less that could send me a DM saying can you check out my music and give me feedback I still got those what's going down I am DJ pain one I'm joined by Cato on the track and Dame Ritter and this is music on supernova Club podcast episode 3 no holds barred music entrepreneurship we're back Instagram is back as well it was down last week and that made us all join fan connects a shout-out to them I mean I might as well plenty since you mentioned it because I think it is a good time to promote the importance of text marketing whether you use fan connect or super phone whatever you know I think Instagram going down just should show you that you do not own the communication between you and your fans and if you did it would be very valuable so I think it's very important to get phone numbers and email addresses so that you can always reach your fans no matter what Instagram or Facebook does whether they're going down or whether they restrict your reach with their algorithm you want to call in the communication with your fans so the music rajkumar Club we use fan connect and if you text smart – 844 206 7800 then you'll get a link to a free trial so I might as well plug that really quick but it is important because we did see the Instagram went down it made it very difficult it makes some people panic I think that's weird but you know if Instagram did go down and you did need to get a message out to your fan your fans you can use a service like fan connect to text them and know that they'll get the message whether Instagram is up or not so might as well plug that well I think we're all gonna have these moments of panic when social media starts restricting our access to the people who follow us who subscribe to us who like this I mean we went through it with Facebook right you can go through that with funk volume day ya know sure I mean I think one of the one of the ways that funk volume grew to what it grew to is because because of the Facebook but early days of Facebook we were early adopters and it didn't have as restrictive of a reach so growing a fanpage at that time wasn't as difficult as it is now I mean it's still possible to do but you know given that the algorithm has gone through some changes and it's more restrictive and they want you to pay for post it's difficult so you know I think that also highlights another point when there is a new social media platform that you think is going to gain traction it's always better to be an early adopter because it's going to be less competitive and easier to gain traction on that platform so that's I think that's another thing to note going forward can I tell you one reason why it was a great thing that Instagram went down yesterday was that that many people less that could send me a DM saying can you check out my music and give me feedback I still got those I think Instagram going down meant something different for everybody it seemed like some people were still able to post it was weird you know I didn't know exactly what was happening yeah I didn't know either I just saw that much some of my posts weren't like loading but I don't know if it restricted DMS or not what's up with that like why do you artists do that like why do they insist because I remember a pain you were probably the same way but my way of getting feedback from people when I was still developing my craft like still working on my music was just like putting it out and posting it and seeing what people thought about it yeah I never like reached out individually to people especially people that I looked up to like I never reached out to them directly to be like yo can you listen to my music what do you think whether it was for validation or an ego stroke or whether I really wanted to get constructive criticism back on my music I just felt like the best way to do that was to put it out see what people think and today it's easier than ever because you can post it on Instagram and whether five people or a hundred people comments on it you'll get some sort of feedback you know so well I think well I think for you I mean obviously you get feedback you have a you have a platform but I think for people they don't have a platform that's why they reach out individually because it's free they have access to it and I gotta admit early days funk volume when we had MySpace we use something called friend blaster and it automated it it automated those that they weren't called direct messages at the time but it automated those messages to people and we use that and was it successful I can't say that it was super successful but I know that we did get responses and we did get additional friends from it so I can't say it was completely wasted effort and it was automated so it wasn't that hard to do so I can't I can't necessarily fall people for doing it now because we did something very similar it's not the same thing I mean that was like 15 years ago though yeah and it was a little newer and maybe there were less people taking advantage of it but still I guess I would be a hypocrite I understand why they do it right because they don't have pain they don't have your platform they don't so when they release music and just post it on their page there's probably just to a few friends and nobody's really giving them real feedback and ultimately you know Cato I think this is kind of on you because you're you're you're promoting an artist right now they learn that you said you found I forget how you found him but yeah yeah and I understand that but it's like it's like what I feel like most people are hoping that they'll get discovered or I'll listen to them and be like holy this is amazing let me sign you let me put you on and well you did whether you're promoting us or why are you shocked that other people are doing oh yeah we could talk about me because I've never in my life said I've discovered anybody Cato's more of the like I said he's the guy that posts up at the Wendy's and just look at the demo okay I'm good guy I have a reputation of being a Jirga asshole this and that I'm so mean and it's because precisely because I don't want people sending me that stuff I still get it a hundred times a day obviously these aren't people who look up to me or support me or even know who I am because if they did they'd know hey penguin doesn't put artists on he just makes music he's artists too so I you know the myspace days are dead it just seems like a lot of people are going off of information from 30 years ago 40 years ago in the music business to inform their their current strategies and everything from sending DM saying hey check out my music to trying to impress the ANR's who really aren't doing much I mean if you don't have fans no one cares but can we talk about how boring some of these messages are I get all right soldier boy did it 15 years ago he tricked people on on the file-sharing services into downloading his music he was the only one doing that he's the only one that worked for because after he used that technique it was dead all right shout out to him for being an innovator but that was stolen long ago you can't possibly think that the stuff soldier boy did when he was a kid is gonna work for you today and but but they're still Eve they're still going strong still going strong and it's man when I check my dams I'm like it's not just the fact that you're sending me five links at once it's that you don't have anything interesting to say it's just like five links please support I don't bro no one wants to hear that please support you're you're grown adults talking about Klee support well I think it is just they don't know what to do or say they just have access to some for free and they want to use it so I think that's where you know hopefully this podcast comes into play hopefully the music entrepreneur Club comes into play is like it's not that you can't reach out to people it's how you should do it and when you should do it and letting them know that hundreds of or maybe thousands of people are doing the same thing maybe they don't know that maybe they think that when they send you a message they are the only one sending you that message and you letting them know like no I'm actually getting a hundred of these a day is kind of an awakening for them and maybe they'll change their strategy I'd let them know sometimes and then they just cussed me out and go on Twitter and say I shouldn't even be verified here's my top here's my top three tips number one is if you are like still super new and super super green to making music and being in the music industry and you have like 15 posts on your Instagram page and none of them are of you actually doing anything related to music then that's like that's the first thing like don't do it number two is I would say is like personalize it right like let that person know that you're familiar with what they do let them know that you've been following them that you're a fan even my comments on my latest post or tell me something that gives me some sort of indication that you are familiar with Who I am and what I do in my history and then the last thing I would say is just keep it short and concise I got so many DMS from people asking for feedback and they tell me their whole life story before they attach a link a SoundCloud link at the very bottom and it's like I don't even have time to read that so I'm definitely not gonna get to that lake I think those three things are important I think the research stuff is key because you know we're sharing a lot of stuff about ourselves on social media I know a lot of people know like for example that I love love boys to men like that's my favorite R&B group so so somebody's saying it was like Dame people compare me to boys to me I would probably click it so it's that type of stuff that you know could differentiate your message from the next person that's just saying hey I'm dope check out my music yeah I mean is that is that too much to ask sometimes it does really seem like too much to ask and it's not just from individuals it's from you you get a lot of pushback from the entire not the entire but but fair percentage of the unsigned artists community when you say things like hey don't send me a message asking me if I rap don't send me a message asking me to sign you when I'm just a producer and I don't have a label don't send me a message asking for management when I'm not a manager and it clearly says what I'm in the bio that people like oh you just you don't want to help anybody it's like alright man that conversation is over I think it goes back to today being Dame and saying this game is it for everybody well there's not only it's not only that it's it I mean it is frustrating at I'm saying what some people do but we have to remember that you know music doesn't have a structured path right we would never see this in any other industries level of unprofessionalism in any other industry because there is a clear path to getting to becoming an investment banker or whatever so a lot of these young people are just jumping in this without any type of training or structure or you know sometimes common sense so that's to be expected for a career path that doesn't just have like a structure there's no school that you have to go to there's no certification certification that you have to have so you're gonna get people all over the place so as frustrating as it is for us sometimes you know it is important to remember that I guess yeah that's what I think as an independent musician is one of the hardest because there is no structure you had to give yourself the structure and it's not like it's not like these other jobs but you don't want these other jobs if this is what you want so even an eye even people that can have a nine-to-five are going to learn from that experience just having to be somewhere at a specific time actually having to spend eight hours working on something because I think a lot of people that poopoo a nine-to-five or just poopoo structure in general have a hard time establishing it for themselves because a lot of artists think they're working eight hours on something but they've never worked eight hours on anything they don't even know what that feels like and they're probably not working eight hours they're probably working thirty minutes or an hour but they're grinding you know according to them so I'm a big fan of structure a lot of it you know so I'm I'm used to implementing structure but that's what most if I would say all artists need but a lot of artists think that once they get signed to a label there's the structure and they're kind of right and they're kind of wrong I know there was a piece of a bit of news I can't wait for you to talk about this because it seems like you're just a pressure cooker full of dynamite on the topic now I hope I don't let you down but I mean my sub my topping no let me did under said one of the topics that that I wanted to talk about was you know I saw a recent Instagram post from an artist named fora and he was signing a look like signing paperwork that would get him out of his deal and he gave kind of the general you know the the stereotypical no more holding me back no more label you know he just kind of blamed situations on the label and I think that's just so tired in this day and age when we have so much access to information we have the lines of communication with artists that are in deals that had been in deals they're open you can reach out to people so to me like getting yourself in a label situation then blaming the label when things don't go right is very predictable and immature right like you should know what you're getting into at this point because there's so many stories about this and you can reach out to so many artists that are in these situations and those are so much information available but but I will say this like isn't isn't a lot of when you signs what label or sign any kind of agreement whatever the other party promises isn't a lot of that just based on what they tell you and not necessarily what's in the agreement like I understand some artists might sign a contract to deliver a certain number of albums but it's not like the label is putting in there we will a hundred percent promote you on so-and-so platforms and like a lot of that is just talk isn't it yeah they'll tell you they will well here's the name like there so so there's there's often at the end of the day sometimes the artist is two more to blame sometimes the label is more to blame we never really know on the outside looking in which one is more we just know that the artist has a bigger platform to tell their story we know that fans are more inclined to believe the artist because there's an attachment to the artist and not the label and just historically the more the skepticism has been placed on the business people because of stories that we heard so when you get into these situations there's expectations on both sides and sometimes and sometimes the label doesn't meet theirs but oftentimes the artist doesn't meet theirs right they not they don't have because you still need to have a structure as as a team separate from the label to get the things done that the label needs from you whether it's the music whether it's you know showing up for interviews whether it's getting videos done and if you're not handling your business on your end it's hard for the label to meet their expectations because they need you to meet them halfway but I think at the end of the day we don't know with these situations like who not keeping up their end of the bargain because the labels are never going to come out in like tell what happened the the artist is so the artists know that they have the they have free will to make up the story and they're not going to say like what they did wrong in the situation right I've never heard an artist that's mad at a label say you know the label did X Y & Z but also I was late to meetings I failed to turn my album in on time and that's why the label didn't do what they did right we'd never hear that it's only what the label did wrong and I know for a fact without you know exposing people's business that a lot of these artists aren't keeping up their end of the bargain I may all expose my own business but I only had one direct labelled artist kind of deal and I think what people forget is you know we always characterize as labels as these machines you know once you get into the label it's just this machine that's moving forward the label is not a machine the label is a bunch of people sitting around in an office working and if you've ever worked in an office job you've been annoyed at your employees they drop the ball their communication is trash they screw up and they'll screw up your project just the same way a chart screws up your check every now and then at your 9 to 5 you know what I mean so for me and my sis I only have one I mean once one experience directly with the label with the artist under me as kind of a production deal license deal sort of situation kind of non-traditional but but good so I'll say I'm not I'm not gonna make a video complaining about the label or anything but I will say that the things that were promised on the contract and outside of the contract were not fulfilled on the labels end and I was incredibly frustrating to me because I'm I mean you know my work ethic and I'm invested in making this project happen and when the label is vague when the label is behind schedule not by a week now by two weeks by months by months yeah and now I'm giving artists some credit I mean there are artists I know personally who have labeled issues and I think now but you just your communication is terrible you know you're always late to stuff I understand it's probably a combination of the label getting sick of you messing up and you expecting too much from them but from firsthand experience and this is what I mean it's so frustrating because when I was in that situation and the label set a release date on our project and then that released a comes and I don't hear from them and there's no roll out and then a month later still nothing and their communication is trashed and they're not giving me a date they just tell me oh yeah yeah no don't worry it's coming and I'm communicating directly with the staff in charge of my project what is my recourse I mean yeah it's on contract I'm not gonna sue them obviously that's too much damn money but I'll end up spending twice the events they gave me just taking them to court so what what does an artist do but get incredibly frustrated well I mean I think every case is different and obviously maybe in your situation the label did you know not fulfill their end of the bargain and I'm not a nun and I've seen the comments from our last podcast and be like game to the champion for the labels and I only do that because we never here we only we never hear from the labels and a lot of times it's not the labels fault and I've seen that and I've seen artists go to social media even when it's not the labels fault to kind of conjure up some support for them and to me it's actually kind of sick and twisted but you know you need to know when you sign you know there's a building that you need to get excited right the people that signed you directly aren't probably going to be like the day-to-day project managers they might be higher level people right and these day-to-day project managers may not know you from a can of paint so it's your job to get the building excited right because you're gonna be working with different departments you know maybe in marketing or PR or there's a lot of other people that are probably going to be responsible for having a hand in your project and you want them just as excited as the people that brought you in the building so understanding that you need to make your rounds and you need to remember names and you need to you know know that people that are in all these meetings and open up those lines of communication with them if you really want you know the full support and sometimes in some times it's not there there's a lot of different moving pieces so and I think we talked about it in an Instagram post you know just understanding that when you signed to a label that's not really where the work stops it's where the works should be starting and it's very challenging but you need to understand those different dynamics and when they are aren't understood you know that's when you know it ends badly and you go under social media for you to complain about the label I will say this though I think there is something to be said when you see an artist that signs to a label and they do not release music for a long period of time I think there's probably some indication that there's like a barrier that's preventing them from just throwing out music because I you know for as for uh I know he's like he has other stuff going on but he's a music artist and and I haven't really ever since that label situation happened I haven't really heard any new music from him well I can't tell I can't tell you why that is but I can tell you that the project that he did release through them sold a hundred and fifty thousand units and he's never done that before so the label did something right and they helped him out in some kind of way but I think that's a conversation that needs to be had if you're an independent artist that's talking with a major and you're used to putting out music all the time that should be a combination that that had that needs to be had before you sign like look how often am I going to be able to put out music what's my we're going to be like because this has been working for me how can you you know just support the structure and the schedule of music that I have always been putting out because I want to continue to do that well what if they lie what do you mean what if they lie what if they tell you here's the schedule and then that doesn't actually end up being the schedule I may put it in the contract but like I said very a very unique situation right you you were signed to a Warner International or something so it's it's it's hard at the corner but I'm glad you got it wrong you're scientists like the the international arm of a you know of a label here right I worked with a lot of artists and I can remember one instance in particular where this artist had signed to a a well-known record label and he kind of had a similar situation where number one I feel like a lot of people at the label come from like not necessarily the music industry so it's kind of crazy when you meet people at these music labels and they really have no background in anything related to music they might just have a particular skill set that's good for that job and so that's one thing I'll say is some people are just not qualified to work at these labels number two they blocked him from releasing music when whenever he wanted wanted to so he hasn't released any new original music in God knows how was that was that a conversation that he had prior to signing did they say hey he would be able to release music and then they switched their tone when he signed I don't know personally maybe maybe not I wasn't in that conversation but I know when the time came for him to you know start releasing music to build up height for the album or whatever they wouldn't let him do it so that's been to me a day it's it's something that you should be mindful before you sign the other thing I would say and this goes back to another Instagram post we made not tomorrow though highlighting the Rolling Stone article that you know over 600 artists were signed last year so there are going to be disgruntled artists because we just can't imagine that 600 artists are going to have all of their needs met is going to be the people that have the dopest music and are prepared and have a team ready for these opportunities because they're gonna have to kind of groom themselves like there's no way that that labels are gonna be able to support 600 artists in the capacity that they think they're gonna that they need to be supported so I anticipate a lot of these stories and they're coming in the coming future because labels are just you know signing people left and right so I anticipate hearing hearing more and more about how labels suck within the next year yeah but you know what that's that's their fault I I understand we had we went off about artists the last time talking about how artists mess up from a managerial perspective and I think managers deal with the worst of of an artist and they I'd love for them to speak up more because that tells a different story that tells the story of maybe a counter-narrative to what we're hearing about artists always being the victim and you know they're not hell no they're not all is the victim and they're not always being victimized by the label or the management and a lot of people lump them to label and the management together and you know then the illuminati conspiracies coming and all they got handlers and all this stuff's like nah they're just acting crazy but with with the label it's just to me you know in the entertainment industry period whether it's music whether it's sports when you put it like this it's it's so weird it's the weirdest industry to be in though these companies will actually hire you to exploit your talent and then hit the pause button on that very thing they they hired you to do it happened as in sports that happens and me I don't play sports so I don't know the specifics but with music you sign a deal with a record label their job is to exploit your talent and then you end up with you know going a whole year without releasing any music so there's no exploitation of talent it doesn't make sense yeah I mean that's never made in those situations that's never made sense to me either because you know just my experience running an independent label like if we did sign somebody we want to get them to a point where they're profitable as quick as possible because we just invested in bringing this person on so you know I know that there's any number of things that could prevent music from coming out for example there could be situations where you know an artist is brought through the door of a label from a specific ANR somebody who recruited them they sign them and then that ANR got recruited to another label so now the person that brought you in is no longer in the building and you don't really have that support so you're kind of just left floating and because the people that are in the building are covering their own ass trying to make the people they brought in successful you know and that could be a small percentage of what can happen I mean any number of things can happen and the blame can fall on you know any number of people but I think going back to just my broader point as as the fans we just don't know what did happen and we typically only hear from the disgruntled artists because they have the microphone and they can tell you whatever the hell they want I was just like if I could change anything about the label system I would like there to be some kind of internal channel through which the artists science of the label can release music just on some kind of consistent basis and it's streamlined obviously when you're signing 600-700 artists a year every rollouts not going to be big but with your kid I mean you're choking out an artist if you if you don't I'm not saying this is happening all the time so Martis just say you know what let the label get mad I'm gonna drop my own music I don't care what they say and I've seen this having on an independent level too not just with majors I think I think the narrative is that major labels are evil and independent labels are here to save you and I've seen way worse stuff going down within the independence then the majors but I just feel like once you've signed to a label there should be some kind of internal mechanism even if you're not a priority to get your music out there on it some kind of consistent basis and that should be a service offer to everybody who signed to that label it's like when you go to an office job there's a drinking fountain in a working bathroom there because you're there eight hours a day it's just something you need to do that makes sense at the label where you where you get assigned there should be some mechanism for you to release music because if you don't release music your fans aren't satisfied they end up abandoning you and now the label can't can't work with you and now you can't work for yourself if you end up leaving the label deal because you've lost all your fans simply because there was no mechanism for releasing music which is your job which is why they sign you to begin with because of your music and your fans but we're talking about that like it's the norm right but and I don't and I don't believe that it is because for a while you know we were hearing about how people were getting signed and it was like cool for them to play like they were still independent right and they and they did that so they can still release music the way they had been releasing music even though they were signed because that's what the label wanted them to do right so in those situations they were encouraged to put out music in the same fashion that they had been putting it out because it was working and it was creating more of a you know organic and and like underground you know rapper buzz and that was part of the major label strategy yeah and that's where that's where the artists who were so astronomically successful that the label already had a vision for them I don't think that's the norm either and we have to face the unfortunately reality that as you said then if they're if they are based on that Rolling Stone article that came out signing up to two acts a day you do the met that's almost eight hundred a year there's no way there's no way even half of those artists are gonna be dropping music consistently I don't believe that that's a terrible ratio speaking speaking of releasing music so I got the notice in my email yesterday that that Spotify cutoff there what is it called like their direct upload service or whatever they started like a year ago where artists can just upload music directly to their platform apparently they shut that down so it wasn't going very well I guess because most people are just distributing their music through aggregators right I don't so I don't know for sure why they did I think it's it I think it was probably a more overwhelming task than they thought it would be you know because originally like the number was twenty thousand songs being uploaded a day but I guess the recent number is forty thousand you know and if they are responsible for you know making sure that there's no copyright violations it can like it seems like a simple thing to do I oh let's just have it blow right through and it go automatically on Spotify with that I think you can get them into a lot of legal trouble if there's stuff that keeps going up that's you know there's copyright violations or songs that aren't you know their songs being uploaded that aren't that artists like it's probably a mess that they didn't really understand that they were getting into without that much upside for taking on the task that's true is that gonna affect artists that much I mean if if people are already willing to pay the you know the twenty dollars for the district kid or they're they're able to just do it all for free through a service like a muse or something I don't even think honestly because that was called there was a certain name for that and Spotify never released it to the public it was still it wasn't it right oh all I know is that I was I was going through just like one of our sponsors a song trust for this upcoming tour and I was on their IG story yesterday and they had a poll up that said are you affected by the recent Spotify shutdown of their direct upload service and I wasn't so I clicked no and then it shows you like the results after you take the poll it was something like 90% of people said no which tells you like you're most people are just using district 8 or tune course CD babies to upload their music get their music on these platforms so I don't think it was as big as when they when they first announced the service like people were going crazy like oh this is gonna be a game changer yeah but I don't think it was I thought it would be just because it would have a domino effect you know I mean like maybe all of a sudden this would be the end of aggregators suddenly Apple would just say alright here's this applications process you no longer have to have a catalogue of 80,000 releases or whatever it is that prevents artists since and really small labels from working directly with the with the distributors I thought that would maybe change that oh Spotify is doing it now Apple has to do it to compete now on Google has to do what Amazon has to do it to compete well that would be a pain in the ass if you had to upload your music to all these different exactly because so yeah they probably just didn't see much of an upside up an upside to it and you know maybe the person the champion that maybe they left the company and the project fell flat I don't know fired I'm not sure painted you what so do we have another another topic before we close it down well we're already at 50 minutes i don't want to open account works this is a can of worms i don't mind if you open a can of worms for the podcast is for pain we'll rename the podcast Anna worms damn you're a genius with the podcast names man even though he hate it all bad podcast and then we talked about making it a segment now we have to check dudes can of worms I'm gonna ask this alright cuz I think we brought something up before probably me I sound like a narcissist right now but I wanted that I think last episode of we talked about what the artists perception of management and label is and what their tasks are so you'll hear you'll hear rapid I hear rappers say this all the time singers whoever say man I can't wait to get a manager because I cause someone because I need them to book my shows or I need them to handle my day-to-day I need them to give me opportunities that basically I need this manager to do every damn thing for me but make music and then the one task that rappers don't want to deal with they want someone else to deal with that blows my mind is social media management they want to manage they want to hire some we're not even hire someone they want that person do it for free but they want a manager or a label or an agent or whatever where they come up with to handle their social media because they don't want to deal with their social media or they want to be mysterious right I remember right one from the tour and we got that question a whole lot we get that question all the time I think whether it's in our sessions whether it's on tour whether it's on insta gems people artists want to be mysterious and to me I think that's just kind of a cop-out because they don't want to deal with social media why because it's overwhelming especially if you go on a social media right now and you have a hundred followers and no engagement and you look at other people who are so further ahead you think wow I can't do this I want someone else to do but that's kind of like the whole point of social media there's the word social in it so if I'm if I have a social media account and Dame is running it that's not social I'm being antisocial because I'm putting Dame in between myself and my fans and supporters that that's the craziest thing to me and it goes back to like the DM thing Cato there's no creative I mean we're as musicians we're creators right I don't want to spend time on social media all the time I want to make music I don't want to spend time networking all the time I want to make music but creativity is a transferable skill I think it is so if I'm creative enough to make a whole album I should be creative enough to come up with something better than hey check out my soundcloud yeah you would know alright and I should be more creative than good morning IG I think it's definitely because you know I didn't come out the gate be in amazement a social media it took me a really long time yeah tell about the boring ass beat making videos you know I used to do some real stupid stuff on social media it's good to admit to that Dane can tell you some of my that I sent him early on just like yo can can y'all promote this on the funk volume channels and I would send him the most boring that you could ever watch and I like this fire he basically just sent a video of him making a beat he didn't really say anything he didn't even really look at the camera and I was like bro you can't post this because nobody wants to watch this you have to engage you have to you know have some personality here yeah and I didn't understand that but after years and years of practice it's just like anything else man like if you wanna if you want to lose weight or be more healthy like you're not going to achieve that just going to the gym once or twice it's it's like a lifestyle change you know you got to make it a habit you got to make it routine and so me over the years just practicing that that skill and that that creative muscle because I do think it is a different sort of creativity than making music and I would say most artists and producers are kind of reclusive you know they probably don't talk to a lot of people anyway so they don't understand how to engage with people but I think if you practice it's definitely a learning skill yeah that's that's actually why I get a little sensitive around it when people are when people say if an artist says something to me like well you're not a creative right I think you don't have to make music to be a I feel like I am very creative but I come up with a lot of ideas like well what you say what kind of worms well you made that have I just stamped it but you know I come up with a lot of ideas whether it's you know business strategies marketing ideas new ideas for businesses like you know we can sit down and have a brainstorming session about anything you know names of things like so you know it I don't know if it's a different muscle or whatever but it's not just artists that are creative I mean you know even if you cook I feel like you're creative like if you're a good cook and you're mixing different ingredients and you're not going by the recipe but you're making something that's super bomb like we all can be creative in our own ways but when artists don't want to do social media I think it's just you know them being lazy or them being intimidated or them knowing that it's going to take a while and they don't want to they don't want to climb that big hill because it's going to take some trial and error just to to know how to communicate your story on social media in a way that catches people attention it catches people's attention it's a tough thing to do it's hard to get momentum yeah I think all of us had to go through that that my last conversation with Curtis King we touched on that and that was kind of the implied apprehension that that we both had when kind of returning to you through these obviously since kind of abandoned YouTube I'm still clinging to the sinking ship a little bit but it's putting out content that's engaging and doing it at a consistent level it's difficult it's a lot of work but you literally look at everybody who's successful and you see that virtually all of them are doing that so what do you do do you work a little harder or do you to say yeah now I'm just gonna keep doing what I'm doing which hasn't been working for me in the past but trust me is gonna work tomorrow it's gonna work next year I think it takes I think it takes a certain amount of self-awareness to write because if you can't understand what people are going to like or want to see then you're never gonna get good at social media if you're just one of those artists that are just always stuck in your own worlds and your own mind about what people like because there's a lot of artists and producers I see that just post self-promotional all day on their timelines like flyers for that they have coming up or you know that people just would not be interested in I think that's a lack of self awareness it's a lack of selective perspective you're not putting yourself in the perspective of somebody who could be a fan of yours who could be a supporter of you I mean you got a figure at its most basic level music is an art is just a connection between humans so if that's something that that you don't actually want to delve into if if you just want to make the music – the humanity part you just kind of mentally defeated yourself well for now it's a connection between humans but there's AI that's who think they might be replacing both artists and producers I've heard the AI generated melodies and all that there they're trash right now might be better soon but yeah you know you hear the mood I don't know pay they're about to replace you with this with this AI generator and that air generators trashed before before we close it down and I do have to shout out Dameon tragedy James who sent me this March he actually sent Cato or cert to some pretty one the the their personalized as you can see they got my name on it and it actually reminds me of like the best piece of merchandise that funk volume ever put out were these personalized basketball jerseys people really loved them like we people ordered them and then we would put their name on our the really high-quality basketball jerseys so I thought you know the search cool but I think that the added you know personalization on the sleeve you know I think is something cool and I think you know for people that are putting out merch you know to personalize it for their fans I think would go a long way so shout out damien tragedy tragedy james for for sending us the merch shout out for the Dame gang what box he said he'd sell me one not he sent me for me I just didn't send it to you because so actually you know us and then comes so it's not wrinkled I've never seen packaging like that but it's it's got your name on it right there bad and that's that's a one of one right there tragedy by tragedy from Arizona we met him in Arizona he came to the NBC tour so I guess a good time to talk to plug the tour as well if you're on the East Coast the NBC tours coming your way from August 4th August 11th we'll be in Atlanta DC Philly Boston and New York get your tickets at NBC tour calm and don't make the mistake of bringing merchandise for only two of the NBC you know he's not he's not getting free beats anytime soon for me shout to everybody that appreciate you we're on an episode three never thought we'd make it this far let's see what happens between now and Episode four much love because everyone face

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